The other night many got a chance to witness history in the making as the greatest fighter of all-time next to Muhammad Ali show and proved that he’s no joke. Manny Pacquiao let all doubters including his opponent Antonio Margarito know that no matter how big, no matter how fierce and no matter how much heart you have, you will undoubtedly lose to a man far too many people have underestimated.
While the world watched and cheered, we’re sure a certain boxer with a big mouth and lots of money sat at home also watching. There is no doubt that Floyd ‘Money Making’ Mayweather has come to realize two unshakeable truths. First, he can’t beat Mr Pacquiao. Yeah, yeah, we heard all the talk about how he’s a skilled precision fighter, a true student of the game blah, blah, blah…Save it. He knows it, I know and you know it. Mayweather watched and realized this past Saturday night this is man he can’t beat.
The other thing he realized is that he’ll never be seen as one of the greatest, even with an undefeated record. As a world champ, he misread history and what it means when you hold such a title especially as a Black man. The ring was always symbolic of power we did not have.. Even with boxing legends like Sugar Ray Robinson, part of what made him great was his accomplishments in the midst of hard oppressions. the accomplishments of boxing greats like Joe Louis and Jack Johnson became a symbolic victories for all those who felt marginalized and oppressed. Their victory was our victory.
Manny Pacquiao has captured that spirit globally. Sadly Floyd Mayweather has misread the signs of today’s times and missed the opportunity to be ‘the people’s champ‘. If Mayweather and Pacman were to fight and he somehow won, Manny would still be seen as champ all over the world. A Mayweather victory would be a hollow victory. Mayweather does not have the admiration of the people especially globally, and no matter how much he brags or ‘adroitly ‘plays the role of villan’ aka the ‘man you love to hate’, he’ll never be seen as a man for the people. What a wasted opportunity.
Understandably that assertion is hard pill for many to swallow, but it’s a truth that Mayweather and many who have come to admire him will have to come to terms with. There are a few thresholds that must be met to truly make a fighter GREAT. The standard is Muhammad Ali..
Ali was and will forever be the greatest even if we could make the case that he was not the ‘best’ to step in the ring. Yes, there were many who threw harder punches. There were some who had faster jabs. There were some who had better defense. Ali was the greatest because he combined all his skills transcended the ring and became a champ on the world stage. He knew how to seize the moment. He always had the pulse of the people. As champ Muhammad Ali came to represent the underdog. Floyd Mayweather as fast and as technical as he is, DOES NOT represent that..
He reps a shallow and ugly version of Americanism that quite frankly we as Black people should not be about. He’s ‘Money Making’ Mayweather when much of the planet including many of our own here in the states are impoverished, unemployed, under employed and clear that big corporation have done them dirty. He’s flossing when folks are starving, no different then the big Wall Street Bankers flossing and justifying bonuses after being bailed out and folks are losing homes.
Mayweather is not seen as the guy who makes the loot on behalf of the people. He’s not seen as the guy continuing the historic role of trickster who has out-thought oppressive situations and with each blow landed and each dollar earned has done it for those who have long done without. Sadly Floyd Mayweather has allowed himself to be positioned as the face of the ‘money making corporation. He’s the establishment. Someone best described him as a Black man who has lost his way.
Unless Floyd is doing some incredible work behind the scenes similar to the way Steelers corner back Troy Polamalu has long gone out in the night to feed, cloth and give money to the homeless, he’ll always be known as the man who bragged and bragged without purpose or politic.
What eluded Mayweather was truly understanding the man who he borrowed a page from in terms of bragging. When Ali fought and bragged, a lot of the times there were political undertones attached to it. Ali became the ‘people’s champ’ by depicting all his opponents both Black and White as figures who were standing in the way of freedom and thus needed to be conquered. He did that with George Foreman. He did it with Ken Norton. He did it Sonny Listen. He did it with Joe Frazier. He especially did this with another boxing champ named Floyd.
Two time champ Floyd Patterson was quick, agile and had great technique, but he’ll always be remembered as the guy Muhammad Ali called an ‘Uncle Tom’ for siding with the system and refusing to call him ‘ Ali’ and instead insisted on calling him by his ‘slave name’ Cassius Clay.
For those who don’t recall, Ali born Cassius Clay changed his name upon joining the Nation of Islam then known as the Black Muslims. It represented him shedding a name imposed upon him and his family by slave owners and Ali was not shy in asserting this and demanding he be addressed by his new name. Most complied, but there were some white sports writers annoyed with Ali’s bragging who refused. For whatever reason Floyd Patterson also refused which led to Ali shrewdly pointed out that Patterson, a black man was Uncle Tomming for the establishment. When the two entered the ring Ali ruthlessly beat Floyd and humiliated him. With each punishing blow he could be heard yelling ‘Whats my name’?
Patterson became the symbol of a good man being on the wrong side of history and while no one is even remotely suggesting that Floyd Mayweather is an Uncle Tom, he’s definitely on the wrong side of history. He’s embraced a mindset and ideology of ‘greed’ and he has the potential to be better than that.
Some have said Mayweather with his flashiness and crudeness is simply representing today’s society. That may be true, but deep down inside he knows he can be so much more. being champ has always meant being so much more. The question is, with Mayweather refusing to fight Pacquiao is he really symbolizing that he’s afraid to step up and be a true champ? Is he afraid to really wear the crown and sit on the throne? Some folks simply are afraid of success on that level. They are comfortable just getting by. Is that how Mayweather feeling inside?
Sadly Mayweather via his actions has become the quintessential American; shallow, crude, materialistic and only about himself. We don’t see him taking hard stands on political issues. We don’t see him in Haiti? We don’t see him in New Orleans.. We don’t even see him in Detroit.. This is not to say he hasn’t done those things..We know he has a charity and this is not to say he’s required to do such things. Is that unfair to put that burden on him? Technically yes, but in the larger scheme of things ‘No’. To not rise to the occasion, Mayweather eludes being ‘Great’ and in many ways he actually cheapens his position. He’s not seen as rebellious or even street so he can’t play the role of being anti-establishment the way a Mike Tyson did.
Mayweather has allowed himself to be the face of a corporatist way of thinking that has long been problematic. He’s the hedge fund head of boxing and to be honest thats the real fight. On the other hand, Pacquiao seems to know what he’s come to symbolized and has continuously moved onto the world stage to be among the Greats.
Manny Pacquiao has come to understand that with much comes great responsibility and thus he’s been out and about doing things that transcend boxing. It could be him dabbling in politics, including being elected to office in the Filipines or it could be him having fun and dabbling in singing. Whatever the case Manny has made himself accessible and has positioned himself to be guy the working class poor person all over the world can relate to and will back up.
Say what you want, but at the end of the day, money and lots of it will only take you so far. Floyd Mayweather knows this. he knows that this is not just about matching skill sets in the ring. Mayweather has to figure out what he really represents. What does he stand for? It can no longer be just the money its got to be something more. Mayweather is wrestling with this knowing that the longer he avoids fighting the ‘people’s champ’ Manny Pacquiao the more he’s likely to wind up be just a footnote in the annals of boxing even if he remains undefeated
Something to ponder
Davey D
Brother D, do you really think popular politicking and perception is the real fight? Because i think no one wins till these two men get to fight,and that that fight is the most important thing. If mayweather wins people will want to know who the person that knocked out the “people’s champ” is, so there is even no opportunity lost here,if he wins he can position himself however he want.
I think it is an interesting observation, but i believe the professional goal of the sport supersede the politics.
Chris.. I disagree.. go outside the country and see how Manny is perceived.. he’s huge.. Its bigger than a fight
And all i want is to see a good fight.i am part of the “people”,i love manny, but if he fights mayweather and beats him, i will think his skills were superior not his politics.
Its not about politics in that sense.. Its about being a champ and being GREAT.. I defined what that means and thats where Manny is headed.. Hell Ali lost fights but is still the greatest
Mayweather is no Sugar Ray Leonard, doesn’t have half the courage. Ray would have fought Pacman twice by now if he was in Mayweathers place. If Mayweather was in Sugars place he would have ducked Duran, Hearns and definitely Hagler. Mayweather sucks. He’s not a warrior just an entrepreneur that boxes.
At this point Manny is legendary without Mayweather. Manny could lose his next fight and people will still fondly remember him. He was exciting to watch in the ring and gave us a lot of memorable moments outside of the ring. Manny is the ‘most interesting man in the world.’ His story is more impressive than the ‘chuck norris jokes’ and ‘most interesting man in the world’ commercials, except this guy is the real deal.
Thanks nameless
And awesome writing Davey D. Been following you my entire life. Raised in Fillmore and have always respected you and your work.
davey D true manny is big world wide. you get to love him the first time you see him fight and you crave to see him do it again. He is just amazing in the ring,and he wins.
These men grew up in different situations that shaped who they are,and how they operate, I just want to see how all that plays out in the ring.So It wont be just a fight,but there has to be a fight. even if it is to know who is a better fighter.
I found your article interesting because it got me wondering if the greats are born or can be made.
“Unless Floyd is doing some incredible work behind the scenes similar to the way Steelers corner back Troy Polamalu has long gone out in the night to feed, cloth and give money to the homeless, he’ll always be known as the man who bragged and bragged without purpose or politic.”
He’s one of the most philanthropic people in Las Vegas. It’s know that he gets out there and feeds people, he goes beyond his Mayweather Foundation. He actually gets out in the street and gives back to the community. My friend, who works at the gym is even expected to get involved. He actually implores his employees to do charity work. So what are you talking about?
Then you’ve got Pacquiao who won a belt at 154. Let’s remember that the fight wasn’t actually at 154, Margarito was not a title holder at 154, and Margarito wasn’t a top contender at 154. So, at 154, Pacquiao is more of a Paper Champ than People’s Champ.
If you do your history, you’ll see when Mayweather moved up to 154 he fought the MAN at 154. He moved up to De la Hoya’s class and beat him at the actual limit. He didn’t demand a catch weight like Pacquiao has done numerous times. His whole career, Mayweather has moved up and beat the man with the belt.
He defeated Corrales at his natural weight, moved up and beat Castillo, moved up and beat Zab Judah at 147, unified the title by beating Baldomir (Baldomir had 2 titles at 147), moved up and beat the man at 154 (DLH). When he came down he beat ricky hatton, marquez, and mosely convincingly.
Most people don’t even realize that Pacman beat DLH and Hatton after Mayweather beat them. Not to mention that De la Hoya was weight drained and came down to fight Pac. You seem bitter for some reason Davey and I don’t know why.
Don’t get me wrong, Pacman is all-time but so is Mayweather. When they fight we’ll see who is ranked higher.
I’m hardly bitter fam and as I said perception is everything.. Ur explaining his fighting stats and I’m saying it goes beyond that..I never said he wasnt good..hes a master of his craft, but he’s selling the world an image.. To be true champ its both skillz and what ur selling..If it wasn’t why he’s selling? Unfortunately for him he’s projected aligned his image with with some of the worse traits one can have at this time.. and if he’s that guy in vegas.. then his good work and deeds will carry the day.. in fact if he doing all that it underscores my point.. u dont wanna be a corporatist in 2010..
The Minny Pacquiao, Manny Pacquiao’s shortest biggest fan, a Youtube and Funny or Die Sketch Comedy has chronicled the media warfare that is Pacquiao versus Mayweather. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3H_chDEz9ss
Here’s a link to all the Mayweather Sketches http://www.wethefilipinos.com/2010/11/pacquiao-vs-mayweatherthe-sketch-comedy.html
@ M. Dunn, THANK YOU!! Floyd is not thinking about Manny Pacquiao! He was with his fiancee enjoying a Trey Songs concert the night of that fight… People are assuming WAAAY too much when it comes to Floyd Mayweather. People look at his persona, and forget about the dude’s technical genius in the ring! He EARNED his riches through blood, sweat, and tears… His arrogant persona is only used to sell fights. I could never hate on my own brother for becoming a legit success in this world. He’s a young, Black entreprenuer that’s going against the grain of society by calling his OWN SHOTS. People should know by now that “mainstream America” hates to see a young, Black brother succeed in such a way that Floyd has while throwing up the “middle finger” to those that doubted him.
Not going against the “establishment?” Yes he did go against the so-called “establishment…” Floyd used to be a fighter on Bob Arum’s “boxing label” Top Rank. When he started on that label, he was the “humble kid” that stayed in the gym. He wasn’t getting all of the big fights he wanted at the price he wanted, so what did he do? The brother told Bob Arum to “shove it”, bought out his contract with his own money, and charted his own legacy through hard work, discipline, and dedication. Do you honestly beleive that sat in well with Bob? HELL NO. So what did Arum do? He chose a fighter whose fighting style is different (and more aesthetically pleasing to the average viewer) than Floyd’s, whole story is a lot more “wholesome” than Floyd’s, and who would be more “likeable” to mainstream society… EMMANUEL PACQUIAO, the “Great Filipino Hope.”
To me, Floyd represents the modern day Jack Johnson. Flashy, arrogant, Black, BUT POWERFUL. Jack fought at a time wherein Blacks were still being terrorized in the South. Mainstream ,White society HATED Jack during his time, due to all of the things he would do (Flamboyant attire, uncouth attitude, and the white women LOVED him). How many Black fighters have you seen go financially down the tubes when they got old? Joe Lewis couldn’t even afford to pay for his own funeral (his former rival turned friend Max did), but yet, he was “America’s pride” in World War II! I hope nothing but the best from this brother, and I hope he doesn’t make the same financial mistakes that his forefathers made. Black people weren’t made for poverty… We were made for survival “by any means necessary.”
Ali is also the all time peoples’ athlete, period. He is the greatest, in every aspect. It’s just too bad he had to endorse Ronald Reagan in 1984. Ugh. The only blemish on a lifetime of inspiration.
Mayweather looks like a punk for avoiding Manny. i watched the fight with a bunch of Pinoy folks and you could just sense the greatness that is Pacquiao with every combo, flurry, and jab. by the end of the fight Marguirito was battered, bruised and bloodied. I don’t usually even like boxing, but the idea of a little guy who beats bigger guys up regularly speaks to the underdog in all of us. Go Manny!
Nice writing…def taking it way out of context…You sound like YOU personally have issues with Floyd “Money Making” Mayweather…Why should we villanize the brother because he boasts and brags…White society has their characters as well and they are allowed to be…I dont beleive that his “bravado” means he does not care about the socio-political issues that plague neighborhoods that he and I ‘m sure his peer group identify with. Ali? the greatest, and the most arrogant of his time and he too made mistakes, often creating contraversy to create “hype..” Not fair in my opinion to compare Mayweather’s political resposnsibility with Ali’s…different era, where a Black Man’s voice was constantly on mute, so the few representations often had to speak “Louder” when given the opportunity. No one is looking for Floyd to be the poster child for the United Nations nor do I believe they are looking for it In Pacquioa (foreigners are always a soft sell)…its entertainment…a test of bravado,, boxing is a sweet science the ultimate symbol of power and domination. I have an eight year old son and he definately doesnt look up to Pac-Man with that endearing look in his eyes and aspire to be greater, but when he sees Mayweather he does and he doesnt care if he is arrogant or shallow, just like the men of my father’s generation could care less about what Cassius did in his personal but when he prevailed in that ring it satisfied the sense of empowerment that America so cleverly oppressed. Mayweather sitting there sunday thinking I cant beat Pacquaio…I hope not, maybe he needs a different strategy and definately he can…ONE
Speechless I think you and I both know I have no ‘personal issues with Mr Mayweather.. I can compare him with the greats from before the same way folks compare fighting styles from past generations..He’s the world champ.. Have we not had conversations about how he jabs, blocks compared to past champs or do we see its unfair?
Mayweather decided to borrow a page from Ali to be ‘the bragger’ to promote fights as you and others suggested, well then its fair to see how he uses that method compared to others..This assertion that no one is looking for him to be beyond the mediocre persona he chooses to display is false.. many of us do care..and can speak to this.. I already said he doesn’t have to do it? I even said it might be unfair fo him to take on that burden.. At the same time.. by not doing so he’ll never be a Great champ.
Does he care? Somne of y’all say he doesn’t.. maybe you know him.. But i doubt it..He’s at the top of his game ..His legacy comes into play.. A true champ will always be judged by both skillz and persona.. There’s no escaping it..He entered into an arena and business where by ur own admittance personality sells tickets..So since thats part of the package.. he gets judged..
A lot of deflection going on here and excuse making for what all know mr mayweather should be doing.. So much so u obscured my point and in doing so made it.. Bottom line we all know he’s on the wrong train.. Time for him to step up.. That’s the crossroads
rationalize however you like…
@ Speechless – Exactly…
The funny thing is Mayweather tried to be everything you want him to be early in his career but the fans and the media didn’t pay him any mind. He was just another boring technical black fighter. As soon as he became the villian he is, the world started to pay attention. Paqcuiao is an all-time great without question and one of the greatest fighters I’ve ever had the chance to watch. That being said what history was made the other night? He was fighting a man who fought only once in almost 2 years and barely won that fight against a random club fighter. A man who had his license to box denied in 2 states after being suspended a year for having plaster in his hand wraps. Margarito is and always was a c class fighter. His only name win is against Miguel Cotto and is there really any doubt of how that victory was won? The 8 titles in 8 weight classes is bull. I would think you should have to actually fight at the weight class to win the belt but in todays boxing world apparently not. Look at the Cotto fight. Cotto was the welterweight champ and had to accept Manny’s demand that he come in weighing 145 lbs. Miguel struggles to get to 147 from around 160 sometimes a little more. Cotto had to accept that demand or not get the fight. As did De La Hoya and Clottey. Is that the behavior of a champion Davey? You basically stack the odds in your favor before the fight even starts. Is that what Ali did? Is that what Sugar Ray robinson did? I don’t think so. The 1st time Mayweather was ready all Manny had to do was take a test. Mayweather agreed to all of Manny’s demands like weight, ringsize, the gloves of Manny’s choice and penalties if weight restrictions were not met. Mayweather gave Manny one demand as Manny gave others and he refused. 1st because he was scared of needles. Then because he didn’t like getting his blood taken. Then because Mayweather doesn’t make the rules and they should just abide by the rules of whatever state they fight in . i’m not saying Pacquiao is on steroids. I pray for boxings sake he is not but I do know of at least 2 Freddie Roach trained fighters who have tested positive for steroids. I hate Mayweathers public persona as much as you do but I’m judging their greatness on what they’ve done in the ring and there is no comparison. Juan Manuel Marquez gave Manny to hard amazing fights and should have got another won but Manny ran away from him. Is that championship behavior? Floyd fought the best in every division and won. No catchweights, no conditions. You can’t say the same about Pacquiao.
Both of your points have been refuted Davey. Money May did say “fuck the system” when he dissed Arum and struck out on his own. He’s a model of black entrepreneurship while Manny is a yes man. And, he’s held his own in the ring by beating the man in each of their weight classes without demands like a catchweight.
Through all the propaganda on HBO, and all the exagerrations about Pac’s career, one thing made sense in the commentation.
When Max Kellerman told the casual fans that Pac’s career post JMM has been carefully orchestrated.
Considering they made Morales come down to 130 after everyone knew he was getting old and having a hard time making weight, even fighting Zahir Raheem at 135.
By Picking the weakest title holder at 135 in david Diaz who had recently arguably lost to Morales, yes the same Morales who was KO by Pac.
And Catchweights, and fighters weight drained etc……
Two totally different personalities. It is what it is.
As far as the fight goes- very close. Both equally quick, smart and skilled. Let’s not forget Mayweather has never lost!!
The question should be asked are boxers supposed to be role models or fit into certain personalities and if so to whaT EXTENT?
tHE MORE HYPE THE MORE $$$
@ favorblade Funny you should mention Leonard as he waiting until Hagler was past his prime to fight and demanded all kinds of conditions to give himself the advantage just like Pacqiuao.
During the pre-fight negotiations, in return for granting Hagler a larger share of the purse Leonard obtained several conditions which would be crucial to his strategy; a large ring (24x24ft), 12oz gloves and the fight was to be over 12 – not 15 – rounds.
Truth!!
WHEN YOU COME UP TO THAT BIG OF A STAGE YOUR A ROLE MODEL WHETHER YOU LIKE IT OR NOT.
I THINK THE POINT OF THE ARTICLE IS THAT MANNY DEFINATELY QUALIFIES. WHHILE ONE COULD ASK THAT MAYWEATHER TO BE MORE OF A POSITIVE ROLE MODEL.
nOW SOME PEOPLE MAY LIKE ONE PERSONALITY BETTER THAN THE OTHER; BUT FOR THE YOUTH ITS IMPORTANT BECAUSE THATS WHO THEY LOOK UP TO
Ya’ll give me a minute…I’m watching Clint Eastwood’s “Gran Tarino”…but def have a reply…quickly @DaveyD…do you consider Sugar Ray Leonard a “Champ?”
Thanks for opening the eyes of people regarding our countryman Manny Pacquiao. More and more he is not just gonna be called the Philippines’ own but more so of the world. Personally I like Floyd Mayweather too but strictly from a boxing perspective. If we are merely talking about skills and technique, it is safe to say that Floyd will always be in the mix. But like you said it is about being Great, a Great Champ if I may add.
I also agree that people should not look to athletes as role models. It should be our parents that should serve as our inspiration and are truly deserving of admiration and adulation. However, the advent of mass media and the popularity of competitive professional sports demand that those who participate in it show a particular trait – PROFESSIONALISM. The youth who engages in the same craft naturally pattern their path after those who preceded them. Thus you owe it to your sport to represent it in a very respectable manner. Thus saying you are not a role model when you are a professional sports figure is a lame excuse.
Again thank you Dave…long live Hip-hop!
Good discussions here – both pro and against Mayweather. But it only boils down to one question: why is Floyd afraid to fight Pacquiao? No matter what everyone says here, Floyd is cowardly evading to fight Manny. Unless he makes a decision fast, he will remain the boastful bully who’s afraid of Pacquiao!
I don’t expect some people to accept Manny. I know Filipino’s aren’t supposed to be boxers, much less 8-time world champs (which Floyd isn’t). Regardless of what Manny does on his personal time, what he does with his money, what he does in his homeland…EVERYONE judges him in the ring.
The day Floyd found out Manny’s weird phobia about needles, is the day he found an “out” to a showdown with Manny. The professional boxing circuit is small, you train with the same sparring partners your opponent does at some point in your career. Guess what, people talk about what goes down in the gym. Maybe a bunch of sparring partners done warned Floyd about Manny’s speed and conditioning. Who knows, but Floyd is scared obviously. Scared of Manny?
He’s more scared of losing and looking like a bum in that ring…
It’s simple. This megafight would be the most money any one has ever made. The money attached to this fight, if it happens…is going to be ridiculous. What’s the hold up “Money Man”? Manny gives away his money and helps so many people. That’s his deal. Floyd is a capitalist, you figure he would jump at the opportunity to make that money. I think he’s not what he appears to be.
And more importantly, as practitioners of boxing…will both these guys have respect for each other after the fight? All the
Floyd, see you in May 2011…or not.
@ Loco Dusty Fear of needles? Really? Did you not notice that new tattoo Manny has? You do know how a tattoo is made right? Like I said, no reason for Manny not to take the test. Floyd agreed to all of Mannys demands. All of them. Floyd asked for one. Manny did not. This fight would have happened already but the truth is Pacqiuao did not want to use the stringent drug testing.
Mayweather that nigga D!!! How you gonna ride on another black man you think Pacquio give a efff about black americans anymore than Mayweather? Mayweather came up out of this American oppresion to flaunt in the WHITE MAN’S FACE…. THAT’S WHY HE DOES WHAT HE DOES MAYWEATHER IS AN INSPIRATION FOR ALL BROTHERS ESPECIALLY THOSE ON THE COME UP ** WE MUST HAVE SUPREME CONFIDENCE TO WIN IN THIS SOCIETY NO MATTER OUR OCCUPATION*** THERE IS ONLY 111111111111111111 MAYWEATHER!
G… save the Black man card for someone else not me bruh..If we gonna play that then I fully expect u supporting Black bizness 100%.. don’t lemme see u with a pair of Nikes’s listening to an album put out on white owned def jam or Universal while wearing a fit from a non Black owned store talking to me abt what brother I ride for.. I hope ur computer or iphone u posted that comment from was also Black owned.. those bizness do exist.. Black man!
Second point.. I said Mayweather is good a master of his craft, but will never be GREAT, why? because of the bullshyt way in which he carries himself… I contrasted him with Ali who he generously borrowed from but then half stepped when it came to doing the heavy lifting, which meant being a true icon..
I mentioned pacman bc he serves as an example of one who is holding it down for his people beyond flashing wads of cash.. Homeboy comes from a place where the living conditions are far worse then any most of live in..so we cant claim the ‘I came up poor in the hood so therefore I need to act a fool’ card.
I would add , if Pacman is globally being embraced which he is.. and if he’s globally being embraced bc he’s on some genuine people power vibe.. You can mark my words, White Americans who oppress us are gonna be rooting for Mayweather over Pac.. why? Because his money values are aligned with the Wall st cats who flaunt their money the same way.. White America doesn’t want a global come up via oppressed people and what they done over the past 10 years is put Black faces on imperialistic ideas and gestures.
Mayeweather via his public actions reps American values not black/human values.. Im pushing for the brother to be Great.. His fight is not with Pacman, his fight is with himself..
Lastly, him flaunting money is not an affront to white America.. Only when he has that Bloomberg/ Meg Whitman/ Steve Jobs/ Bill Gates/ Lloyd Blankfein money will he be of any real consequence to the power brokers in America. Show me a Mayweather casino on the strip then I can buy the argument he’s flaunting money n white America’s face. Until then its a guy with chump change showing off money that can be dwarfed early by mid-level cat in a brokerage firm
As cliche and as corny as it may sound, I think the bottom line Davey D was pointing out was that it’s the way you carry yourself inside AND outside of the ring that dictates what kind of champion you are. Look at Manny, despite pro-Mayweather fan arguments about who he’s fought, etc, and you see not only a sports legend, but a congressman whose goal it is to serve the people. Look at Floyd, with his unblemished record, one of the greats in boxing, but he’s plagued with legal issues, family members of ill-repute, and racist rants on his Ustream account.
I’ve done a lot of reading these past few days, whether it be Facebook comments on Floyd’s page, comments on related articles, YouTube videos, etc. and the one thing I noticed is that Floyd’s following is so enamored by his attitude that it rubs off on them, resulting in brash rationalization, racism, name-calling, and ignorant comments. It’s almost like Money May’s telling them it’s ok to act that way. I’ve also noticed that Floyd’s fans have “selective hearing” when it comes to backing their man up. They’ll mention the refusal of drug testing during the first set of negotiations, which lead to a 14 day pre-fight compromise, but they won’t mention when the second set of negotiations happened, Manny accepted any type of drug testing, which resulted in Floyd going back on hiatus during an informal press event. A deadline was proposed the second time around by Arum and instead of being a true champ, Floyd let the deadline slip by unanswered. You will never, ever hear Floyd fans talk about this, nor will you hear them talk about Floyd taking Xylocaine, a PED that apparently is illegal in all states except for Nevada, in which Floyd does all his fights. It makes me wonder why Floyd declined using Cowboy Stadium (bigger attendance, bigger money). You will also never hear a Floyd fan mention that Manny PASSED his drug tests. What you WILL hear is everything from “Dog Eater” to “Tadpole-faced Manny” to “Little Filipino”, to calling Manny fans “dick riders” to “faggots” to everything else under the sun.
Let’s face it – It’s arguable that both Manny and Floyd have chosen less-than-suitable opponents. We can argue for days about that and nobody will budge. What CAN be said is that after this last fight, Manny has been asked on numerous occasions if he will ever fight Floyd. “If the fight happens, great, if not, I’ll still be happy because I’ve done everything I can in boxing.” He’s also said, “I will fight anyone under 150.”
The challenge has been put out there and Floyd’s FB page has been silent since last Friday, save for a few pictures of him hanging with his boys.
So let’s talk about the second negotiation. Bob Arum put a 14 day time limit on Floyd to accept then fight knowing that his head trainer is facing a trial. That’s like me challenging someone to a fight across town while their house is on fire and saying if you don’t show up in 15 minutes you’re a coward. Doesn’t make much sense does it.
http://www.boxingscene.com/?m=show&id=32858
If you click that link you’ll see Bob Arum’s new approach the land this fight. It includes calling Floyd directly, talking to his lawyer, and then negotiating with Floyd’s representation. WTF? Makes me wonder how they’ve been doing business before. The fact of the matter is after the first negotiation, Floyd had already signed the contract. Manny hadn’t. None of these other contracts had a name on it…chew on that.
@M. Dunn Fine, the past 2 negotiations have been debacles – agreed. First round of negotiations, Manny’s name wasn’t on there because Manny’s camp believed Floyd’s demands were unwarranted. Was it suspicious? Even as a Pacquiao fan, I was starting to question it (but subsequent actions by Manny brought me to believe he was innocent). Second round of negotiations, a big part of me thought that all Floyd had to do, as a champion, was say yes and sign the contract. However, a part of me also felt that it was a bit rushed.
I think Arum’s new approach is pretty straight forward, it checks Floyd’s availability, it gets a yay or nay from Floyd, and true negotiations start. No distractions from personal legal battles, congressional duties, etc. We all want the fight to happen, right? Let’s not dwell on these past negotiations and let’s hope that this supposed 3rd attempt works out for both parties.
There was no reason for Manny not to take the test the 1st time. Floyd signed the dotted line but Manny would not. The 2nd round of negotiations was a facade. They new that Floyd would not fight again so soon period especially against the likes of Pacqiuao and especially with his uncles trial looming. Arum new this and used it to play the casual boxing fan into thinking Floyd is scared and he succeeded. I also see the hate and disgusting comments from certain Floyd fans. It’s abhorrent and their idiots. Let’s just hope this fight happens soon.
Really davey i mean you kickin it about manny like he’s making a real difference. Hell in mannies homeland he did win the election or did he? Manny has not done a damn thing in his country but have the locals scream and holla poverty is below the bottom there and manny dosen’t speak out about it on the world stage how i know i lived there foe 3years . just like the earlier commemt manny is a yes man for the devil and all his wins were over the hill or drained fighters manny been knocked out twice and won’t fight marquez again manny dosen’t stand for nothing unless the devils allow him in other words good P.R. my brother. Davey stick to real issues with substance because mannys not one just a good boxer for today but when Mayweather and manny do tangle always Bet On Black!!! Peace LordRah
No Lord Rah.. Read what I wrote.. I said Manny is the people’s champ.. He is being genuinely felt around the world and the moves he’s making are capturing hearts and minds of folks.. Thats what I said fam.. I also said that mayweather with his flash has ironically positioned himself to be no different than greed laden bonus having wall street cat..He’s lost his way and if he continues a masterful fighter will be a footnote..
As far as Manny and his plight back home.. we know he’s loved, we know he’s giving back in ways that can have long lasting impact.. Him being a congressman is a step.. The bills he introduced for hospital, anti-poverty bill and the other thing for teachers.. I need to check on that.. Its stuff folks can get with.. And I make no illusions about him being a super radical cat or a revolutionary, just like I would never say that about Ali…But I will say he’s on the right side of history..
And when the two tangle I’ll be on Manny..but like I said thats a decision and apprehension mayweather needs to come to terms with
y’all is a bunch of putos with your twisted opinions, delusions, and false rationalizations. get a grip on reality. boxing is entertainment. let’s stay entertained and stop arguing about who did what, who makes more money, etc…cuz in the end their lives are their lives to be lived how they choose and want to live…and you have your own life so stop living through other people and go outside and enjoy nature, the world, people, god’s goodness to humanity. let’s break up this reality tv mentality, this jerry springer outlook, this hateration in the world. i mean i could go off on who my favorite is and argue my points till my head explodes, but then what? i’ll just keep it to myself and agree with some and disagree with others. i respect those that think for themselves and formulate their own opinions with rationale and reason. peace and jah bless. asalaam alaikum. buddha bless. amen.
am pro Pacquiao, i love your work not because you’ve said good things about Pacquiao, but because you put an emphasis on what really matters.
respect!
This is a very good article and well written. Thanks Davey D. I think people are taking what was written out of context. Both Mayweather and Pacquiao are great fighters and have truly earned where they are at today. What Davey D is trying to point out is that both men differ outside the ring by way of public perception.
I respect Mayweather for what he has accomplished. But in the public eye, what has been captured on film takes away from people seeing him as a heroic figure outside of boxing. There was a video of Floyd with an 18yr old cancer patient who was part of the Make a Wish Foundation. I think his wish was to see a Mayweather and Pacquioa fight. Who turns down wishes? Mayweather told the kid he was gonna take a couple of years off – not even a “we will try to make it happen” just to make the kid feel good about his wish. The other video that was aired on ESPN was of Mayweather making some racist statements (i’m guessing) directed at Pacquiao. There are ways to offset these negativities by doing something good that the public will see and change the way people see him.
On the other hand, there’s Pacquiao who was and is hitting the airwaves on talk shows. Before the fight, he was on Jimmy Kimmel Live and sang a duet with comedian Will Ferrell. The audience was amused. I’m not sure if Pacquiao even knows how to brag. Maybe because english is not his first spoken language or maybe he truly just doesn’t boast or brag. That’s what people like. The fact that he ran for public office in his home country and lost and decided to run again showed commitment to the people of the Philippines that he wants to make a change. Also, in the post fight interview against Margarito, his comment was something to the effect of “I just want to make people happy and watch a good fight. It’s my job and I’ll try my best.” Clearly he’s doing this for the people. Then he also says when he gets back to his home country, he’ll work as a “public servant” to try to help the people in the Philippines. That’s the kind of stuff that make people think – this guy is not a bad guy, he’s actually doing something noble outside the ring.
I think that is what Davey D is trying to point out. With the problems in Haiti, New Orleans floods and other events…Floyd could have done something (who knows, maybe he has but we just don’t know) to make himself more visible than a fighter – some type of heroic act. Look at George Clooney, a white man setting up a telethon to help victims of the New Orleans flood and the earthquake relief in Haiti. No one asked him to do it but he did it. He’s known for being a humanitarian. I think when you have the means to make a difference, you do it.
I’ve said my peace. I’m out.
Thanks Henry, u hit the nail on the head…
@M.Dunn:
“Then you’ve got Pacquiao who won a belt at 154. Let’s remember that the fight wasn’t actually at 154, Margarito was not a title holder at 154, and Margarito wasn’t a top contender at 154. So, at 154, Pacquiao is more of a Paper Champ than People’s Champ.”
“If you do your history, you’ll see when Mayweather moved up to 154 he fought the MAN at 154. He moved up to De la Hoya’s class and beat him at the actual limit. He didn’t demand a catch weight like Pacquiao has done numerous times. His whole career, Mayweather has moved up and beat the man with the belt.”
If you do your history, Mayweather demanded Marquez to move up from 135 to 147. Also, Ricky Hatton was undefeated in JWW (140lbs), not 147.. Ofcourse, Mayweather asked the fight to be at WW (147lbs). It is not catch weight fight, but it STILL gave him an edge–which is the whole point. Pacquiao fought both of them at their natural weight classes(HE ACTUALLY FOUGHT THE MAN AT THAT WEIGHT CLASS). So who deserves more credit? The Cotto fight was at 145lbs, people forget that Cotto weighed 146lbs when he defeated Shane Mosley. He made sure he could keep up with a WW at 147 so he won a wide UD against Clottey. And Margarito? I agree that making it a fight for the JrMW title was BS, but it is a catch weight of 150lb and it doesn’t benefit Pacquiao one bit! Margarito actually got the edge in terms of weight because he is bigger. Now name me a natural JWW, or WW who beats Cotto, Margarito, and Clottey the way Manny did?
So what if Pacquiao defeated Delahoya and Hatton after Mayweather? By your logic I should discredit Mayweather’s win against Marquez. So I should discredit Hearns win against Duran because Hagler already beat him.. WTF? That doesn’t make sense.
Styles makes fight, the way Pacquiao man-handled, or should I say knocked the f*ck out of both Hatton and Delahoya, so can I say the way he annihilated them makes him better? Hell no, I don’t believe that because they are two different types of boxers.
Manny is a natural 140lb-147lb fighter. You mentioned Mayweather vs Castillo and Corrales(which were great wins IMO).. What about Pacs fights with the future HOFs Barrera, Morales, and Marquez?
No thanks to downplaying his accomplishments and making it seem like he didn’t move up in weight. 154 title=BS. 147 and below he is a legit champ, and a future member of the boxing greats. As someone who knows trains in this sport, Mayweather and Pacquiao are above everybody else.
@Chris
“Juan Manuel Marquez gave Manny to hard amazing fights and should have got another won but Manny ran away from him. Is that championship behavior? Floyd fought the best in every division and won. No catchweights, no conditions. You can’t say the same about Pacquiao.”
Manny ran away from him? really? when was this? Source please. Read up, and yes you can say the same for Pac.
It will be easier for all of us if the Mayweather fans accept things as it is. None of the Pacman supporters here ever did say that Mayweather is not a good boxer Again, Floyd Mayweather Jr. is a great boxer but NOT A GREAT CHAMPION. And oh yes, to those who make comments about how Manny is not affecting lives over here? You really don’t know Manny and much less the Philippines, so keep your thoughts to yourself and do your research better.
To our black friends, please stop playing the race card specially to somebody like Davey D you’ll just be schooled like Floyd will when he fights Manny. If you really think a lot was taken from you, do something positive about it and please don’t act as if its just your race which suffered such. Our country suffered 400 years of oppression from different colonial powers and we are just picking up the pieces now. We still get the short end of the stick somehow even while practicing American style democracy. But while we complain, we also do something positive about it. How about you guys?
Matter of fact don’t even play the race card when it comes to Hip-hop, many people from other racial roots contributed to this culture and its several art forms. Jews, Muslims, Blacks, Whites, Latinos and Asians including Filipinos. Treat everyone with dignity and respect.
Back to you Teacher Davey D
I definitely agree with a lot of your points, and Pacquiao’s greatness definitely comes from outside of the ring as much as it does from inside, but I think a lot of the points you make about Ali are kind of bad. Ali was a great fighter, no doubt about that. Ali did many great things outside of the ring, this is true. Ali’s trash talking was HORRENDOUS. It was funny as hell, no doubt about that, but to give them political undertones is to do a HUGE disservice to Ali, as well as to his opponents, many of them good men in their own right. Fact is is that his trash talking was its own imposition upon the characters of the men he fought, men who have proven themselves outside of the ring as well. I can’t see how anyone could possibly justify his level of trash talking in this way as anything other than pure entertainment, because that’s what it was, and Ali knew it. Yes, he was very conscious of the black struggles, but if he had any foresight I’m sure he’d realize that the way he went about handling it was not the right way because his opponents were never given a chance to have their own voices represent themselves…but how could they when Ali was so freaking loud.
@ semieducated http://bleacherreport.com/articles/428664-bad-blood-prevents-third-pacquiao-vs-marquez-fight Here’s the link. Manny turned down a 3rd fight with Marquez. As for Cotto he actually weighed 154 the night of the Motley fight and Freddie Roach even said in an interview he asked for the extra 2 lbs because he new it would weights drain and weaken Cotto. If not why ask for a measley 2lbs.
Dave… I think you should write like this more.. look at all the responses and posts here. You struck a chord, but not only that, you really made alot of sense. I may disagree with aot of your views, but this article was on point. I think the issue doesn’t stop with Pacman vs Mayweather.. I mean alot of our star athletes are little more than cash cows and corporate shills. Not that I am explicitly against getting your money, BUT to be great you need to socially relevant, like Ali, and others, these guys took risks, they for lack of a better term “stood up against the Man”. They fought for something,… just my two cents..
great article and solid points.
just a little correction though. it was against Ernie Terrell who Ali had issues about his Muslim name and called out “What’s my name!” in the ring as he beat him up.
on prophet it was floyd patterson as well http://archive.recordonline.com/archive/2006/05/12/news-floydpat-05-12.html
I don’t know about that “If Floyd wins it’ll be looked as a Hollow victory business.” People would praise Floyd for that victory. Any everyone Manny has beaten Floyd beat. So what Manny be Margarito. Floyd beat the man that beat him. GO MONEY! Even Ricky Hatton who fought both said “Floyd would win.”
I don’t know about that “If Floyd wins it’ll be looked as a Hollow victory business.” People would praise Floyd for that victory. Anyway everyone Manny has beaten Floyd beat. So what Manny beat Margarito. Floyd beat the man that beat him.Manny just get more press because he’s from a 3rd world country and his trainer is white and got a bad case of the shakes. GO MONEY! Even Ricky Hatton who fought both said “Floyd would win.”
It’s so nice to see people amped about boxing on this thread!!
As far as becoming the peoples champ, it was always going to be Pac as far as the world goes. Mayweather could do everything Ali did and it wouldn’t matter in 2010. Mayweather is a millionaire American at a time when millionaire Americans are destroying entire national economies and in the case of Iraq entire countries. Add to that our countries history of involvement in the Philippines and Mayweather doesn’t stand a chance in international PR V. Pac. With a black president it’s not as easy for black Americans to separate themselves from our foreign policy as it was for Ali. Especially in the eyes of the outside world.
I bet Mayweather would win. But more importantly those two could save boxing no doubt about it. They’re both being selfish because the sport that gave them everything is being pushed out of the national consciousness by MMA and they could stop that from happening with a fight and guaranteed rematch. I hate MMA, to hit an opponent when he’s down is not a sport it’s a bar room brawl.
Please do an edit on your article. It was not Floyd Patterson who refused to call Ali by his name; that boxer was named Ernie Terrell. Floyd Patterson was the youngest heavyweight champ pre-Tyson and one classy dude. 1
Silky it was floyd patterson.. http://www.boxing-memorabilia.com/aliuppercut.htm
http://archive.recordonline.com/archive/2006/05/12/news-floydpat-05-12.html
lemme know if u want more links
@lordrah you lived their for three years, i live their my whole life!!! You can’t say he’s doing nothing. Do you know what it feels like to have a person from where i come from get to the top and become famous. HE IS THE PEOPLE’S CHAMP BECAUSE THE PEOPLE SAY HE IS!!! Remember that!!
yo davey, you were right about ali calling patterson an uncle tom; ali called quite a few of of his opponents “uncle toms”, even joe frazier (which was uncalled for). But terrell got the “what’s my name?” treatment in the ring. regardless, great article on mayweather and pacquiao.
my two cents: as a boxer, mayweather is a master techinician, beautiful to watch from a boxing purist’s perspective. unfortunately, with boxing being a business (and entertainment), it’s a fact that it is quite difficult to sell a black boxer’s fights; unless he is knocking everyone out, or acting a fool, or on a path of self-destruction (e.g. tyson). people just love seeing a black person act ignorant in this country… i don’t know why.
do i agree with the way floyd conducts himself inside and outside the ring? from what i have seen, probably not. but i understand why he does it. he has to sell his fights and ali provided a blueprint. but ali did much more. ali stood for justice, equality. in fairness, floyd, i’m quite sure does some charitable work as well, but his persona certainly overshadows all the good that he does.
don’t get me wrong, i love seeing a black man get money. i know the feeling of pulling yourself out a hole, playing the hand that was dealt to you and win. it’s a wonderful thing. BUT, when you are put in a position that floyd is, to be able to do a lot of good (and at the very least appear to stand for something good) you should know better. and yes you are right, the stacks he flash is chump change relative to the american elite. It is quite pitifully comical, and speaks volumes about his weakness and insecurity.
all i know is, when pacquiao fights, a whole nation stops, a hundred million prayers go to the Almighty. his story is easy to sell, his humility is a breath of fresh air in a testosterone-filled business, laden with braggadocio. he gives his money away to the poor and destitute (and he has never tested positive for steroids). how can you not like that?
hey Silky, I happen to think mayweather can sell his fights sans the money making character.. Even if he used it there’s a way to do it and still be on the side of the people.. Imagine if he got in the ring and said he was money making to rebuild an entire neighborhood or send 20 kids to college..Imagine if he fought and said he was doing this on behalf of those who have prostrate cancer, old folks with alzheimers, cats in the hood with bad credit or to help get innocent folks out of jail like the Geto Boys who laid out 200 Gs in lawyer fees.. He would be a great cham[p who did it for the people.. How could anyone not love that..
If it was on a business vibe.. the money spent as he sells fights would be less then he ‘d spend on a grade a publicist.. The possibilities are endless.
Hey Davey you spelled Sonny Liston wrong.
And another thing how come MANNY NEVER FIGHTS HELLA TIGHT AFRICAN AMERICAN FIGHTERS ONLY MEXICAN FIGHTERS HMMM….Benard Hopkins brings up a good point……..
While watching Manny Pacquiao dominate Antonio Margarito during Saturday night’s HBO pay-per-view televised clash at Cowboys Stadium in Arlington, Texas, many African-American boxers and fight fans wondered when they would see the Filipino superstar challenge Floyd Mayweather “or any other top notch black fighter.”
At least, that’s what one of boxing’s elder statesmen, Bernard Hopkins, believes.
“Maybe I’m biased because I’m black, but I think that this is what is said at people’s homes and around the dinner table among black boxing fans and fighters. Most of them won’t say it [in public] because they’re not being real and they don’t have the balls to say it,” said Hopkins, a 45-year-old future Hall of Famer and a multi-division champion.
“But I do think that a fighter like the Ray Leonards or anyone like that would beat a guy [like Pacquiao] if they come with their game,” said Hopkins (51-5-1, 32 knockouts), who will challenge WBC light heavyweight king Jean Pascal (26-1, 16 KOs) on Dec. 18 on Showtime.
“Listen, this ain’t a racial thing, but then again, maybe it is,” said Hopkins. “But the style that is embedded in most of us black fighters, that style could be a problem to any other style of fighting.”
Pacquiao (52-3-2, 38 KOs) earned the WBC’s vacant junior middleweight (154 pounds) belt, his eighth crown over as many weight classes, with Saturday night’s unanimous decision over the Mexican-born Margarito (38-7, 27 KOs) at Cowboys Stadium.
Already the WBO welterweight (147 pounds) champion, Pacquiao won for the 13th straight time, including eight knockouts during that run. Nicknamed “The Mexicutioner,” Pacquiao’s triumph over Margarito continued his dominance over Mexican fighters, against whom he is 11-0-1, with seven knockouts during his winning streak.
Speaking for Pacquaio, the fighter’s adviser, Michael Koncz, said that “Manny has nothing left to prove to anybody.”
“I would say to hell with all of those guys who are talking,” said Koncz. “Manny has done more than anybody in boxing than anybody has ever imagined. He has the right to select his opponents. These black fighters, you know, we’re not prejudiced. We don’t care if they’re black, green or blue.
“All that we care about is what fighter has a following. When these fighters that are crying about fighting Manny develop a following, and can prove to us, statistically, that it’s economically feasible, then we will have no problem fighting them. But until then, they can cry all that they want.”
But Kevin Iole of Yahoo! Sports wrote recently, that “Pacquiao still has [yet] to face the ultimate test — the fast, speedy, in-his-prime opponent that a [Floyd] Mayweather would be.”
A fighter such as Sugar Ray Leonard, Iole contends, “represents the kind of fighter Pacquiao has yet to face: A big guy with tremendous speed and quickness as well as punching power, defensive skill and a quality chin.”
“That’s why Floyd Mayweather would beat Manny Pacquiao because the styles that African American fighters — and I mean, black fighters from the streets or the inner cities — would be successful,” said Hopkins. “I think Floyd Mayweather would pot-shot Pacquiao and bust him up in between the four-to-five punches that Pacquiao throws and then set him up later on down the line.”
But negotiations to make a bout between Mayweather (40-0, 25 knockouts) and Pacquiao have twice fallen apart, even as Koncz said that Pacquiao still very much wants that fight.
“As far as Floyd Mayweather, he has [Top Rank Promotions CEO] Bob Arum’s phone number and [Mayweather’s adviser] Al Haymon has Bob Arum’s phone number. He has my phone number,” said Koncz.
“But we’re not going to chase him. We gave him two opportunities and they insulted us and attempted to make us look foolish. So, we’re not chasing him. If he wants to call us, then he’s welcome to call us.”
Pacquiao has faced and beaten the counter-punching Joshua Clottey, a native of Ghana, but Hopkins discounts that win.
“Clottey is ‘black,’ but not a ‘black boxer’ from the states with a slick style. So you can’t really say that Clottey is an African-American fighter in that sense,” said Hopkins. “No, I’m talking about an inner city, American-born fighter who has the style of maybe a Floyd Mayweather or a Zab Judah or a Shane Mosley.”
Pacquiao’s promoter, Bob Arum, has gotten wind of such rumblings, but, as Hopkins said, rarely aloud.
“I have heard that, yes. A lot of people don’t articulate it. But a lot of people, in effect, hint at it. But you’re absolutely correct, and there is no argument there,” said Arum. “Like I said, there’s no argument there that he has not fought a top African American fighter. But the notion that he would not fight an African American fighter is ridiculous.”
If a mega bout with the unbeaten Mayweather cannot be made, Arum said that he is considering putting Pacquiao in against other African-American boxers.
Arum said that former world titlist Shane Mosley is perhaps the first consideration for Pacquiao, whose trainer, Freddie Roach, told FanHouse that he no longer wants Pacquiao to fight below the welterweight division.
Arum also mentioned the winner of a scheduled Jan. 29, HBO-televised bout featuring southpaw WBC junior welterweight (140 pounds) king Devon Alexander (21-0, 13 KOs) and WBO counterpart Tim Bradley (26-0, 11 KOs), or a match-up against talented WBC welterweight champ Andre Berto (26-0, 20 KOs).
“A fight with Shane Mosley would answer that situation,” said Arum. “And maybe the winner of Devon Alexander and Tim Bradley would answer that. Andre Berto might be a consideration, also, yes.
“There’s no reason why he wouldn’t fight an Andre Berto, because he’s at 147 pounds. Berto’s Manny’s size, so, you know, that’s good. We’re looking for African-Americans to fight. I would think that it is likely that Manny will fight an African-American in his next fight, whether it’s Floyd Mayweather, Shane Mosley or somebody else.”
Koncz concurred that Mosley (47-6-1, 39 KOs) is the leading candidate to face Pacquiao.
“As for Shane Mosley, I had discussions with him in Texas, and that’s a possibility. I told him that we would talk after the [Margarito] fight,” said Koncz.
“I guess that he’s with [adviser] James Prince and not with Golden Boy [Promotions], so that makes things easier for us also,” said Koncz. “Out of all of the African-American fighters, the one with the biggest following and that makes the most economic sense to us would be Shane Mosley.”
Arum said, however, that he would not be likely to match the nearly 5-foot-7 Pacquiao, who weighed in at 144.6 pounds against Margarito’s 150, with the nearly 6-2 Paul Williams (39-1, 27 KOs).
A southpaw former three-time world champion, Williams has weighed in at as much as 157 pounds for non-title, middleweight (160 pounds) wins over former world champion Winky Wright and Sergio Martinez — the latter in a December clash of southpaws during which both fighters were floored in the first round.
Williams weighed 145.5 pounds when he out-pointed Margarito in July 2007 for the WBO welterweight crown, and nearly 146 pounds in June 2008 when his first-round knockout dethroned southpaw Carlos Quintana in a rematch of Quintana’s February 2008 win over Williams.
Williams, however, has not fought at 147 since the second Quintana bout.
Pacquiao, meanwhile, weighed in at a career-high 145 3/4 pounds for his unanimous decision win over Clottey in March, and entered the ring at a weight disadvantage of 148-to-165 against Margarito.
Pacquiao, nevertheless, won virtually every round against Margarito, even as the eventual winner was doubled over by a vicious left-handed body shot by Margarito in the sixth round.
Arum said that Pacquiao absorbed a lot of punishment against both Clottey and Margarito, suffering sore wrists and ribs against Margarito, the latter of which required an MRI examination before he was cleared.
Arum won’t risk similar injuries that could result from a Pacquiao-Williams clash.
“Paul Williams is just too big. I mean, Manny Pacquiao is a little guy who has to eat to get up to a weight to fight Antonio Margarito. I want to put him in at least with a couple of fighters,” said Arum.
“Every fight he’s fighting these giants. I mean, you know, if I keep doing that, I’ll just wear him down,” said Arum. “If Mayweather is not available, then I want to put him in with guys his own size.”
Williams, however, simply wants a shot at Pacquiao.
“It ain’t got nothing to do with whether you’re African-American, white, Chinese, Puerto Rican or whatever. None of that really matters to me. If you’ve got the skills, then you’ve got the skills,” Williams said on Tuesday from Atlantic City, N.J., where he is preparing for Saturday’s HBO-televised rematch with Martinez (45-2-2, 24 KOs).
“Manny is the man out there now. He’s got all of the hype and he’s got eight titles that he’s won, so he’s the man and you’ve got to respect that and give him his props,” said Williams. “But my thing is that they say that he’s beaten up a lot of big guys, and they say that I’m beating up a lot of little guys, so I’d love to get in there and fight Manny Pacquiao.”
But Williams may just have to wait in line, said Koncz.
“The selection of opponents for Manny has nothing to do with race, creed or color,” said Koncz. “It’s all about business. And they can cry all that they want. It’s all about economics, now, with Manny’s career.
“We have the luxury of doing that because Manny has proven to the world that he’s got nothing left to prove. If there are any boxing people out there who doubt him, then, to hell with them.”
So talk totlak..ur basically saying manny needs to beat a Black boxer to legit??? Really? cmon bruh what are saying? he needs to fight a slickster? No fam No u and I both better..
re: hey Silky, I happen to think mayweather can sell his fights sans the money making character..
yo davey, yeah i agree with that point too; he can sell his fights by shedding his “money-making” character but then he gotta come off as either some “black brute” or “angry negro” or some other wack stereotype to sell off. guillermo rigondeaux on the undercard of last week’s fight donated his purse from a previous bout to haiti, but no one is eager to watch this kid fight; he is a wicked talented slick boxer, excellent boxing pedigree, but folks aren’t lining up eager to shell $ to watch him.. the late vernon forrest was a great great guy who did good things in the atl area and he did not attain super-superstar status… matter of fact, some hood cats capped his ass
it’s the same thing in the rap industry today. in general when a rapper comes off like he got a brain and is bringing out a positive vibe he/she has a hard time selling records, or even getting on the radio (you know damn well what i’m talking about) meanwhile cats spewing weak garbage lyrics are steady on rotation. it’s just mind-boggling.
the relevant question in both instances is who buys the fights/records? in cases of hispanic, asian, and european fighters, they have a strong following that will watch their fighters regardless for pride and country. a black fighter here in america simply does not enjoy that privilege. and like i posted earlier, folks here in america seem indifferent to a black person trying to do good. what sells? shows about cats slangin dope (i loved ‘the wire’, i’m guilty too), studio gangsters bangin on wax, DNA paternity shows on maury povich, i mean damn, the list goes on. sht is beyond floyd mayweather.
again i reiterate, do i agree with how pbf gets his? no. do i understand why? yes.
Silky I have to disagree.. we do sell without giving in.. far too many examples show otherwise.. and the smarter u are the more creative you can become.. With all of his money mayweather can afford a slick publicist who can sell his image..its done all the time.. I dont buy the angry negro persona.. and lets say he had to do that.. at this stage in the game how long does he continue? at some pt u gotta switch up
“So talk totlak..ur basically saying manny needs to beat a Black boxer to legit??? Really? cmon bruh what are u saying?”……
Well…actually….YES! He poppin that Ali sh*t, well come on Ali! Defend your belt against some WORTH challengers. Not cause they’re BLACK, BUT BECAUSE THEY TIGHT! How you going be fighter for over ten years in 8 DIVISONS and you haven’t came across Winky Wright, Mosely, Zab Judah etc etc.. yet? Hell Roberto Duran was on his tenth brotha when he was at where Manny is. Iran Barkely? Oscar De la Hoya is a FINE champion fought Felix Trindad, Mosley, Pernell Whitaker, Ike Quartey, HELL Benard Hopkins even and well as the lesser known good Mexican fighters and that’s why he deserve the praise he gets. Beatinig a bunch of no named sub par champions is not the next ALI!
many wasnt talking ali anything fam.. u gave a weak argument that makes no sense..
Well Bob Arum his promoter was poppin Ali. So that is him ; ). I also wanna state to that I think because Manny is from a 3rd world conutry “of sorts”. I’m sure that’s why he was fighting primarliy latin frighters that aren’t Americans as well, I don’t think it’s because of any malicious intent(There’s a world outside the U.S. you know). And joshing to the side the Latin fighters he’s fought are true champion. But you do have to play into account that there is a certain type of fighter he is not fighting style wise. Hopeful now that he’s “Bigtime” that will change, and we’ll see what he’s got.
The filipines is a 3rd world country of sorts?? explain that one?
The race card plays on the deck it seems.
Manny hasn’t fought any Black American fighters? Sorry fella’s but in this generation there aren’t as many Black fighters in the Flyweight to MiddleWeight divisions like back in the 80’s/90’s. So now the measuring stick is beating the Black man. How about beating the best in each division? And the best are the Mexican fighters, cause I don’t see no one else reppin’. De La Hoya fought Trinidad (Puerto Rican, not black) and Quartey (African). Trinidad was at the top of his game.
Needles. I know the difference between blood drawn and tattoos. I have a few tattoos, comparing that to getting blood drawn…you got to be an idiot to try to compare the two. You talking about skin scratching to drawing lifeblood out of your system. The dude has a weird phobia, Filipinos are superstitious and such. Excuse? Nah, it’s just what Manny believes. So what’s up with Floyd, when Manny accepted the testing terms? He called Floyd’s bluff, Floyd folded his hand.
Now on the manly tip, Floyd is looked at as backpeddling. He spoke so much crap, racist rants, brought up steroid allegations…for the most part if you are going to talk the talk you are going to fight. Why the push for the blood test Olympic style, when all of Floyd’s career he has fought in Vegas and had no problems with Nevada Commission rules. Why is Floyd all of a sudden scared of Manny?
Floyd isn’t rich, he has too many cats in his entourage. Floyd will be fighting well after a Manny/Floyd fight. What he does with his money is his business, but homie needs to keep some for himself and his retirement. He got robbed in Vegas. He went on to “fight” in the WWF. What true boxer is out there play fighting in a wrestlers ring?
Floyd is too talented to waste his potential. His insecurities show, his need for his uncle, and his relationship with his father…all things he has to deal with internally. Putting him on a pedestal as Ali, that’s too much for any man to be held to. Ali was fighting the government, served time, stuck to his beliefs and word, and still fought in the ring. Ali is the exception, it’s not fair to try and put Floyd on that level. Floyd is a great tactical boxer, but he is just a small fry kid compared to an Ali.
The boxing world wants to see this fight happen. The promoters have both screwed it up. They would have to be the dumbest boxing promoters in the history of boxing to not make this fight happen. The handlers for both fighters, should be working towards compromise and give the fans what they want.
Keepin’ it real, the style of Black American Boxers have the same components as orthodox boxers and unorthodox boxers across the globe. Speed, Agility, Power, Strong Chin, and a Big Heart…is what all boxers have in common. Don’t play the race card, let’s just keep it in the ring…and leave it there.
I know it’s hard for many to accept a Filipino world champion, but that’s what we are looking at in front of us.
A bit off subject, but since Ali’s name is up, what has happened to the black heavyweights, can’t nobody deal with the Russian or what?
MMA is gaining ground, boxing is still a better spectator/casual fan sport, but the politics involved in boxing make it a bore. MMA isn’t a black sport yet, but more and more black athletes are getting interested in it.
Ali didnt give 2 ish for what white america thought of him, probably less of what black people did until after his conversion, one of the most popular pics of Ali is of him in the bank vault with his winnings, he also was known for his womanizing ways after converting( not a good look for role model). America cuddled up tp Ali, he did not conform for them. Johnson spent his life trying to live like uppity white folks but brothers loved him, he was reviled throughout the world and never was considered the peoples champ, he was the blackmans champ. its surprising to me that you can be a proponent for hip hop when 90% of the artists are doing far worst stunting then money may. So many times people have said this guy was going to beat may, that guy was going to beat may, but look at the end results, the same thing will happen with pac, he know he will lose the first contest and then he will be able to retire from boxing on the rematch which will surely come. also Mayweather dont have as much money as the people you mentioned but 90% of the world including you will never see 1% of how much money that dude has made. I know this thread is old but just seeing this article.
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manny pacquiao is the greatest he has an amazing and interesting personality and has a way of out boxing any man who stands in front of him no matter hw big or strong or quick they are, no doubts manny is the best there is he is an insperation .
Unfortunately Mayweather is all money and not Manny. Interesting fight but I’m afraid it will be sad to see Mayweather just running around the ring disappointing many fans of Boxing. He can do all the talking he wants and that he is good at, ” talk and no action. “
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